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I would be pretty interested in knowing the true operating costs actually. I don't really know how much it costs to run a flight. I just find it strange that some airlines are doing absolutely fine and still manage to have very resonable priced flights, like jet blue for instance.. while other airlines can't seem to survive.Quote:
Originally Posted by kyshel
I'm just really worried aboutt he US Air AA merger. That would really be a terrible thing.
JetBlue is not a "full service" airline based on their destinations. If you look at their map of where they jet, they only cover populated major cities and vacation destinations--period. There is a huge gap in the center of the US. They can't bother to jet to those cities because there is not enough profit with their limited aircraft. They don't fly to Kalamazoo, MI, Pierre, SD, Peoria, IL etc... Legacy carriers like AA, US, UA, DL etc, offer service to those areas and maintain a full fleet of different aircraft to accommodate those pax who want to fly to major cities. All of those carriers have been thru financial turmoil at least one time.
JetBlue has their place, but it isn't competing head-on with legacy carriers, except in select markets. Same with Southwest and LCCs like Allegiant and Spirit.
There are many sources of info regarding cost per seat mile online. You can start with price of crude oil (Brent crude today is $112 today) then find the cost of av gas, then get the gate cost per airport, and make yourself NUTZ in the process. I have no clue how anyone calculates the costs of an airline, other than what are the factors they deal with in every aspect. Union employees, health care, maintenance, catering, CS, publicity, IT... the list has to be staggering.
I dislike when people gripe about $25 for a bag. Try shipping one and getting it at the same time you arrive at your destination. Who wants to have it added to the ticket price, when they do carry-on? I have no trouble doing a carry-on for 2-3 wks anywhere in the world.
bet it costs a LOT more.
Oh, yeah, that merger could be a nightmare!
According to recent news stories they said airlines are making billions on baggage fees, however, I would concede that the billions figure was probably all the domestic airlines profits total and not just 1 airline. Although I am sure they all are making a decent enough profit from the fees.
Maybe this will clarify the reality of airline baggage fees:
Key Word:
COLLECTED
US airlines collected $1.7B in bag fees in the first half of 2012 | Fox News
Yes--all US carriers--that includes Spirit, the supposed "fee whores" of the industry.
Read to the end for the accurate "profit" information--last paragraph:
"Without the fees, many airlines would struggle to remain profitable. The industry turned a $2.3 billion operating profit with a 6-percent profit margin in the second quarter, according to BTS, up from $228 million, or a 0.7-percent margin, during the first quarter, a traditionally slow time of year."
Gee, who knew airlines needed to make a profit?
This is the "extended" version of the AP article:
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505145_1...ustry-profits/
Read the last section regarding fuel costs--it's not just your gas tank and your heating bill. It trickles thru the entire system of our costs for food, clothes, etc--just like an airline--you have expenses and they have expenses.People need to manage their lives like tiny little businesses...
kyshel, I love reading your travel postings. However, when it comes to your posting regarding legacy airlines, you are faced with overwhelming odds in defending your positions. Public perception is seldom influenced by logic, especially when it comes to emotional issues such as personal travel interruptions, escalating fares, and ancillary fees, etc. Most of public really could care less about the issues being highlighted in the American Airlines bankruptcy proceedings. Just greedy people on all sides fighting for more money and benefits while the travel public suffers.
I don't disagree with you or the logic of your positions; undoubtedly you are much more tuned into the insider matters of the industry than most of us here in the community.
However, many, if not most of the public, will continue to see airline employees as the villains until the American Airlines bankruptcy is resolved.
I'm glad you enjoy my comments--I do this for my health!! HAHAQuote:
Originally Posted by jsattapr2
Look, I understand the frustration, but to blatantly ignore that these costs are not going away is just that--ignorant. This is not the fault of the EMPLOYEES. I strongly dispute your comment in that regard.
How about placing blame at the correct source?
This is not the first bankruptcy of a major air carrier, nor will it be the last. Several US carriers have survived--many have not. Business models vary in the US--JetBlue differs from Spirit, US Air, AA, DL, UA, WN etc.
Many airlines in other countries are supported by governments. How about Sabena, Varig or Malev? Heavens, Varig was supported by the FIFTH largest country in the WORLD. They are no longer functioning for a reason. They were not profitable.
I don't care what the public perception is--REALITY is not perception. I don't know anyone who lives off a paycheck signed by "perception". Our travel public is either going to pay more to fly a legacy carrier for their needs, or go elsewhere to catch a LCC to limited markets; it's a choice.
Look at some of the other countries in the world and see how many options you have to fly from city to city--look at flights inside Egypt. You have one choice--Egyptair...etc. Very common in other countries.
Count your blessings that you have a great air system in our country--and ways to reach so many other places on the planet.
Safe and Happy travels.
Keep challenging and I'll keep on my toes to answer.
kyshel, we don't agree on this topic.
So, I'll cease posting on the matter and I'll chime in on luxury travel ideas and experiences.
btw, I still have a Braniff International Demitasse spoon which somehow found it's way into my pocket years and years ago. I hope the loss of that spoon was not the contributing factor to their ultimate demise.
I agree to agree and disagree depending on the particular topic. I think they should just stop with the fees and raise the prices - the perception the public sees is the adding of fees for every little thing and they feel nicked and dimed.
Just raise the price - what you see is what you get instead of trying to pull the traveler in with "low airfare" and then having the traveler having to add $ for food, $ for baggage, $ for a "better' seat, etc.
The airlines should just compete for who has the best total airfare.